{"id":4286,"date":"2013-07-31T10:41:54","date_gmt":"2013-07-31T10:41:54","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/?p=4286"},"modified":"2013-08-10T12:11:44","modified_gmt":"2013-08-10T12:11:44","slug":"cen-ait-vs-cen-fhad-two-different-questions-that-sound-almost-alike","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/cen-ait-vs-cen-fhad-two-different-questions-that-sound-almost-alike\/","title":{"rendered":"C\u00e9n \u00c1it? vs. C\u00e9n Fhad?: Two Different Questions That Sound Almost Alike"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>(le R\u00f3isl\u00edn)<\/p>\n<p>Lately I&#8217;ve been wondering if there&#8217;s a good Irish equivalent for the English expression, &#8220;to put your foot in your mouth.&#8221;\u00a0\u00a0 The main ingredients are straight forward enough.\u00a0 The usual word for &#8220;foot&#8221; is &#8220;<strong>cos<\/strong>,&#8221; although that can also mean &#8220;leg,&#8221; which could suggest that one is even more of a &#8220;<strong>freang\u00e1la\u00ed<\/strong>&#8221; than the original expression &#8220;foot-in-mouth&#8221;\u00a0 suggests.\u00a0 The standard word for &#8220;mouth&#8221; is &#8220;<strong>b\u00e9al<\/strong>.&#8221;\u00a0 But I&#8217;ve never seen an Irish expression that uses these elements to suggest the verbal gaffes to which we are all prone, even in high places (like the classic response &#8220;A pissometer?&#8221; to being shown a piezo-meter water gauge).\u00a0 C\u00e9 a d\u00fairt \u00e9 sin?\u00a0 Go ahead, just Google it.\u00a0 It&#8217;s a classic!<\/p>\n<p>Of course, come to think of it, the Irish for a &#8220;piezo-meter&#8221; gets even closer to the misinterpretation&#8211;it&#8217;s &#8220;<strong>p\u00edsim\u00e9adar<\/strong>.&#8221;\u00a0\u00a0 For pronunciation, I&#8217;d just note that the first &#8220;i&#8221; is long, so the pronunciation is &#8220;PEESH-ih-MAYD-ur.&#8221;\u00a0 Anyway, a lot of cases of &#8220;foot-in-mouth&#8221; disease are much more benign, and certainly much less publicized.\u00a0 Given the number of words that sound alike in many languages, it&#8217;s not surprising if people hear one thing when someone has said something else.\u00a0 There are many famous examples of misheard lyrics (aka musical &#8220;mondegreens&#8221;), ranging from &#8220;Gladly, The Cross-Eyed Bear&#8221; to &#8220;She&#8217;s Got a Chicken to Ride.&#8221;\u00a0 But what if someone asks you something that sounds like &#8221; kayn-ahd&#8221; In Irish?<\/p>\n<p>This phrase can be especially challenging if the question is simply asked as a phrase, without an actual subject, verb, or object.\u00a0\u00a0 Many people will recognize that it&#8217;s either &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9n \u00e1it<\/strong>?&#8221; (What place? Where?) or &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9n fhad<\/strong>?&#8221; ([kayn ahd] How long?&#8211;remember the &#8220;fh&#8221; is silent).\u00a0 In my experience most people settle for &#8220;<strong>c\u00e9n \u00e1it<\/strong>&#8221; (what place?, where?), and answer accordingly, regardless of which question was actually asked.<\/p>\n<p>Let&#8217;s look at the role of pronunciation here.\u00a0 In theory, at least, the &#8220;slender t&#8221; sound of &#8220;<strong>\u00e1it<\/strong>&#8221; should come through clearly, but for some speakers it&#8217;s clearer than for others.\u00a0 The sound approximates the English cluster &#8220;-tch&#8221; but keeping more of the &#8220;t&#8221; and not simply settling for the &#8220;ch&#8221; of &#8220;church&#8221; or &#8220;child.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>In practice, however, it happens often enough that someone asks &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9n fhad<\/strong>?&#8221; (How long?) and gets a place name as an answer, like, for example &#8220;<strong>i mBost\u00fan<\/strong>&#8221; or &#8220;<strong>Baile \u00c1tha Cliath<\/strong>.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>My own solution to this problem has been to ask people &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9 chomh fada<\/strong>?&#8221; for &#8220;How long?&#8221;\u00a0 It&#8217;s a perfectly legitimate alternate to &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9n fhad<\/strong>?&#8221; and seems to cause less ambiguity.\u00a0 Of course some people ask &#8220;<strong>C\u00e1 fhad<\/strong>?&#8221; for &#8220;How long?&#8221;, and often give the &#8220;<strong>fhad<\/strong>&#8221; [normally pronounced &#8220;ahd&#8221;] an actual &#8220;h&#8221; sound [kaw hahd], which doesn&#8217;t help matters, especially since some people say &#8220;<strong>C\u00e1 h\u00e1it<\/strong>?&#8221; [kaw hawtch] for &#8220;Where?&#8221; (What place?).<\/p>\n<p>What&#8217;s my bottom line solution to this dilemma, especially for learners?\u00a0 Repeat the question you think you&#8217;ve been asked.\u00a0 This is actually done often enough in English, as in, for example:<\/p>\n<p><em>A: What time does the train leave?<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>B: What time? (probably with extra rising intonation).\u00a0 At four o&#8217;clock, I think.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>So in Irish we could have:<\/p>\n<p><em><strong>A: Bh\u00ed m\u00e9 ar saoire sa Fhrainc.<\/strong><\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><strong>B: C\u00e9n fhad?<\/strong><\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><strong>A: C\u00e9n fhad?<\/strong><\/em> (repeating the question but not answering it)<\/p>\n<p><em><strong>B: &#8216;Sea.<\/strong><\/em> (at this point, B might even restate the question to help out A, when it becomes clear that A is a learner).\u00a0 <em><strong>C\u00e9 mh\u00e9ad seachtain?<\/strong><\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><strong>A: \u00c1, tuigim anois, coic\u00eds.\u00a0 Bh\u00ed m\u00e9 ansin ar feadh coic\u00edse.<\/strong><\/em><\/p>\n<p>In a slightly different scenario, B might simply repeat &#8220;<strong>c\u00e9n fhad<\/strong>&#8221; or might try &#8220;<strong>c\u00e9 chomh fada<\/strong>.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>Of course, if one is living in a small Irish-speaking community, misunderstandings like this are not likely to occur.\u00a0 It&#8217;s mostly when people from different places around the world have gathered together for an Irish language event.<\/p>\n<p>As for my own linguistic gaffes, the most unforgettable one for me, and probably for my interlocutor at the time, was actually in Welsh.\u00a0 I mixed up &#8220;<em>arlywydd<\/em>&#8221; and &#8220;<em>arglwydd<\/em>.&#8221;\u00a0 I knew I couldn&#8217;t remember which was which, although I could always interpret them in context. \u00a0So I was talking about an American president, which should have been &#8220;<em>arlywydd<\/em>,&#8221; and called him &#8220;<em>arglwydd<\/em>,&#8221; which actually means &#8220;lord.&#8221;\u00a0 It probably came across as even funnier in a place like Britain where there plenty of people who really are lords.\u00a0 <strong>C\u00e9n t-uachtar\u00e1n a deir t\u00fa?\u00a0 Bhuel<\/strong>, my lips are sealed.\u00a0 But it was a good few years ago.\u00a0 That gaffe, at least, wouldn&#8217;t be likely to happen in Irish, where the words for &#8220;president&#8221; (<strong>uachtar\u00e1n<\/strong>) and &#8220;lord&#8221; (<strong>tiarna<\/strong>) are quite distinct.<\/p>\n<p>I was also a bit startled one time to realize that in Welsh, a word that I was quite accustomed to using, &#8220;<em>rhyw<\/em>,&#8221; means not only &#8220;sort,&#8221; &#8220;kind,&#8221; &#8220;some,&#8221; and &#8220;certain,&#8221; but also &#8220;sex&#8221; and &#8220;gender.&#8221;\u00a0 I&#8217;ve wondered, in retrospect, what some of my earliest Welsh may have sounded like.\u00a0 Hopefully context clarified everything (<em>rhywle, rhywbeth, rhywun, rhywfaint, rhywfodd, vs. rhyw-wr<\/em>, etc.).\u00a0 If not, my interlocutors were too kind to let me know.<\/p>\n<p>The bottom line for Irish?\u00a0 There are two ways (at least) to ask &#8220;which place&#8221; (where) in Irish: &#8220;<strong>c\u00e9n \u00e1it<\/strong>&#8221; and &#8220;<strong>c\u00e1 h\u00e1it<\/strong>.&#8221;\u00a0 There are also at least two variations for &#8220;what length&#8221; (how long): &#8220;<strong>c\u00e9n fhad<\/strong>&#8221; and &#8220;<strong>c\u00e1 fhad<\/strong>.&#8221;\u00a0 &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9n \u00e1it<\/strong>&#8221; may sound like &#8220;<strong>C\u00e9n fhad<\/strong>&#8221; (because the &#8220;fh&#8221; is silent) and &#8220;<strong>c\u00e1 h\u00e1it<\/strong>&#8221; may sound like &#8220;<strong>c\u00e1 fhad<\/strong>.&#8221; \u00a0One solution&#8211;repeat the question back for clarification.\u00a0 The phrase may be clearer a second time or your conversation partner may use another phrase that will clarify what they really want to know.\u00a0\u00a0 Eventually it all sinks in.\u00a0 <strong>Ach glacann s\u00e9 am.\u00a0 De r\u00e9ir a ch\u00e9ile a th\u00f3gtar na caisle\u00e1in<\/strong>.\u00a0\u00a0 Which is basically the Irish equivalent of &#8220;Rome wasn&#8217;t built in a day,&#8221; although, as you can see, the word &#8220;Rome&#8221; (<strong>An R\u00f3imh<\/strong>) isn&#8217;t mentioned. \u00a0\u00a0<strong>Bhuel, sin \u00e9 don bhlag seo.\u00a0\u00a0 \u00c1dh m\u00f3r oraibh!\u00a0 &#8212; R\u00f3isl\u00edn<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>P.S. as for &#8220;foot-in-mouth&#8221; disease, if you know a traditional Irish equivalent, please write in and let us know.\u00a0 It may just be one of those untranslatable idioms, which, if translated literally, fall sort of flat.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Gluais: freang\u00e1la\u00ed<\/strong>, contortionist<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>(le R\u00f3isl\u00edn) Lately I&#8217;ve been wondering if there&#8217;s a good Irish equivalent for the English expression, &#8220;to put your foot in your mouth.&#8221;\u00a0\u00a0 The main ingredients are straight forward enough.\u00a0 The usual word for &#8220;foot&#8221; is &#8220;cos,&#8221; although that can also mean &#8220;leg,&#8221; which could suggest that one is even more of a &#8220;freang\u00e1la\u00ed&#8221; than&hellip;<\/p>\n<p class=\"post-item__readmore\"><a class=\"btn btn--md\" href=\"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/cen-ait-vs-cen-fhad-two-different-questions-that-sound-almost-alike\/\">Continue Reading<\/a><\/p>","protected":false},"author":36,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"content-type":""},"categories":[3898],"tags":[96548,292431,292432,292437,292427,292425,292426,292436,292434,292429,5667,292430,3364,292433,292435,7296,7307,292428],"class_list":["post-4286","post","type-post","status-publish","hentry","category-irish-language","tag-ait","tag-arglwydd","tag-arlywydd","tag-ca-fhad","tag-ca-hait","tag-cen-ait","tag-cen-fhad","tag-fad","tag-gladly-the-cross-eyed-bear","tag-how-long","tag-irish","tag-mondegreen","tag-questions","tag-rhyw","tag-shes-got-a-chicken-to-ride","tag-welsh","tag-where","tag-which-place"],"aioseo_notices":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4286","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/36"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=4286"}],"version-history":[{"count":3,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4286\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":4289,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4286\/revisions\/4289"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=4286"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=4286"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=4286"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}