{"id":460,"date":"2010-10-14T06:08:55","date_gmt":"2010-10-14T06:08:55","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/?p=460"},"modified":"2010-10-16T06:17:19","modified_gmt":"2010-10-16T06:17:19","slug":"still-more-on-%e2%80%9cbefore%e2%80%9d-i-ngaeilge","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/still-more-on-%e2%80%9cbefore%e2%80%9d-i-ngaeilge\/","title":{"rendered":"Still More on \u201cBefore\u201d i nGaeilge"},"content":{"rendered":"

The possibilities for \u201cbefore\u201d seem almost endless, but given the first seven phrases we discussed in recent blogs (cheana, roimh, sula, thar, os coinne, os comhair, ar tosach)<\/strong>, plus the additional \u201car\u00fa<\/strong>,\u201d I\u2019ll wrap up this series with just a few more examples.\u00a0 \u00a0A few are new to this series and some are representative expressions with words we\u2019ve already discussed:<\/p>\n

New to the series:<\/p>\n

ar aghaidh <\/strong>[erzh<\/sup> ai]: Sheas s\u00e9 ar aghaidh Sh\u00e9amais.\u00a0\u00a0 <\/strong>He stood before (in front of) S\u00e9amas (based on the word \u201caghaidh<\/strong>,\u201d which means \u201cface\u201d or \u201cfront\u201d).\u00a0<\/p>\n

faoi bhr\u00e1id: Seo an t-\u00e1bhar at\u00e1 faoin\u00e1r mbr\u00e1id. <\/strong>\u00a0This is the subject that is before us (i.e. for discussion).\u00a0 This is actually based on the word \u201cbr\u00e1id<\/strong>,\u201d which means \u201cneck\u201d or \u201cthroat.\u201d\u00a0 Not that \u201cbr\u00e1id<\/strong>\u201d is what I\u2019d usually say for \u201cneck\u201d (that\u2019d be \u201cmuine\u00e1l<\/strong>\u201d) or for \u201cthroat\u201d (that\u2019d be \u201cscornach<\/strong>\u201d).\u00a0 But that\u2019s typical of idioms — they\u2019re often based words that are a step removed from the most basic vocabulary.\u00a0<\/p>\n

Recap (roimh<\/strong> and sula<\/strong>):<\/p>\n

roimh Chr\u00edost (r.Ch.), <\/strong>before Christ (as in \u201cB.C.\u201d)<\/strong><\/p>\n

roimh n\u00f3in (r.n.)<\/strong>, ante meridiem (as in \u201ca.m.\u201d); contrasts with \u201ciarn\u00f3in<\/strong>\u201d (p.m.) <\/strong><\/p>\n

Mairg n\u00e1r smaoinigh t\u00fa sular labhair t\u00fa.\u00a0 <\/strong>It\u2019s a pity that you didn\u2019t think before you spoke.\u00a0 And if you find a useful, real-life context for that gem, please do let me know!<\/p>\n

Another interesting dimension to this whole discussion is that sometimes a \u201cbefore\u201d phrase can be expressed with either \u201croimh<\/strong>\u201d or \u201csula<\/strong>\u201d (to return to our first two, and primary, examples, from the September 29th blog).\u00a0 But please note that the two words are not actually interchangeable, as each requires a different verb form (verbal noun vs. conjugated form):<\/p>\n

a) Roimh imeacht di, d\u00fairt s\u00ed \u2026 <\/strong>(Before she left, she said \u2026, lit. before leaving to her, she said \u2026).\u00a0 This structure uses the preposition \u201croimh<\/strong>,\u201d which is followed, as prepositions are, by a noun.\u00a0 In this case, the noun is \u201cimeacht<\/strong>,\u201d which is an ainmfhocal briathartha<\/strong> (verbal noun).\u00a0 For this phrase to be meaningful, it needs another preposition, \u201cdo\u201d<\/strong> (to), to round it off.\u00a0 Since we\u2019re talking about a woman, we use the form \u201cdi<\/strong>,\u201d which is feminine, 3rd<\/sup> person singular.\u00a0 \u00a0So, while translating this phrase as \u201cbefore she left\u201d makes sense and flows well in English, it does disguise how the word \u201cshe\u201d is used in Irish in cases like this.\u00a0 In English, the word \u201cshe\u201d is the subject of its clause but in Irish, \u201cshe\u201d is the object of a preposition, becoming \u201cher.\u201d<\/strong><\/p>\n

b) Sular imigh s\u00ed, d\u00fairt s\u00ed \u2026 <\/strong>(Before she left, she said \u2026).\u00a0 No need for a literal translation here, since the Irish and the English are as similar as possible, structurally.\u00a0 Remember that we added the final \u201c\u2013r\u201d<\/strong> to \u201csula<\/strong>\u201d here because we\u2019re dealing with the past tense.\u00a0 You\u2019ve probably seen that \u201c\u2013r\u201d<\/strong> ending before, as in \u201cAr imigh s\u00e9<\/strong>?\u201d (Did he go\/leave?) and \u201cC\u00e1r imigh s\u00e9<\/strong>?\u201d (Where did he go?).\u00a0 <\/strong><\/p>\n

And finally, speaking of interchangeability, here\u2019s a case where it really works:<\/p>\n

roimh i bhfad <\/strong>[riv ih wahd], before long<\/strong><\/p>\n

sula i bhfad <\/strong>[sul ih wahd], before long.\u00a0 Note that the unstressed \u201c-a\u201d<\/strong> of \u201csula<\/strong>\u201d pretty much disappears in pronunciation.\u00a0 In fact, this is sometimes written \u201csul i bhfad<\/strong>.\u201d\u00a0 And, to go ahead and make a short story long, it can also be written as \u201csar i bhfad<\/strong>.\u201d\u00a0 A related phrase is \u201csara fada<\/strong>,\u201d which seems to contradict normal grammar rules, but is used nevertheless.\u00a0 And then there\u2019s \u201cgan m\u00f3r\u00e1n achair<\/strong>,\u201d which also means \u201cbefore long.\u201d\u00a0 And \u201cgan mhoill<\/strong>.\u201d\u00a0 Short story long enough?\u00a0<\/p>\n

Fuaimni\u00fa <\/strong>(Pronunciation): <\/strong><\/p>\n

ar aghaidh: \u201caghaidh\u201d <\/strong>sounds like \u201caye\u201d (or \u201ceye\u201d or \u201cI\u201d), since the \u201cg\u201d and the \u201cd\u201d are silent.\u00a0 I transcribe this sound as \u201cai,\u201d following the precedent of the International Phonetic Alphabet.\u00a0 And for those who might be wondering, yes, the preposition \u201car<\/strong>\u201d (on) is pronounced with a slender \u201cr\u201d even though it\u2019s written broad \u2013 hence the \u201c-zh<\/sup>\u201d in the transcription. \u00a0It\u2019s a noticeably different sound from, say, the broad \u201c\u2013ar<\/strong>\u201d in \u201cgar<\/strong>\u201d (nearness) or in the verb \u201ctar<\/strong>\u201d (come). <\/strong><\/p>\n

do <\/strong>[duh]: just a reminder that this is simply pronounced with the unstressed vowel sound, like the \u201ca-\u201c of \u201cabout\u201d or like \u201cuh, I don\u2019t know.\u201d\u00a0 <\/strong>It\u2019s not the same as \u201cd\u00f3\u201d <\/strong>[doh].\u00a0 Also, please don\u2019t let the sound of the English word \u201cdo\u201d (as in \u2018to do\u201d) mislead you here.\u00a0 They\u2019re completely unrelated, but I mention this because I have heard many beginners pronounce \u201cmo<\/strong>\u201d as \u201cm\u00f3\u201d <\/strong>and \u201cdo<\/strong>\u201d as \u201cd\u00f3\u201d <\/strong>or as [doo].\u00a0 <\/strong><\/p>\n

faoi bhr\u00e1id<\/strong> [fwee vrawdj], faoin\u00e1r mbr\u00e1id <\/strong>[FWEEN-awr mrawdj]<\/strong><\/p>\n

roimh Chr\u00edost <\/strong>[riv hrzh<\/sup>eest]: the usual \u201cv\u201d sound for \u201c-imh<\/strong>.\u201d\u00a0 The \u201cC\u201d of \u201cChr\u00edost<\/strong>\u201d is silent, leaving you with a breathy initial \u201ch\u201d and a slender \u201cr,\u201d which is, admittedly a bit of a mouthful.\u00a0 Key thing, at least, is not to pronounce the \u201cC\u201d.\u00a0 Ironically, once the basic form \u201cCr\u00edost<\/strong>\u201d [krzh<\/sup>eest] is lenited, becoming \u201cChr\u00edost<\/strong>\u201d

<\/div>, as happens here, it looks more like the English \u201cChrist.\u201d\u00a0 The same pronunciation applies in direct address (a Chr\u00edost<\/strong>) and in possessive phrases (corp Chr\u00edost<\/strong>).\u00a0 <\/strong><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

The possibilities for \u201cbefore\u201d seem almost endless, but given the first seven phrases we discussed in recent blogs (cheana, roimh, sula, thar, os coinne, os comhair, ar tosach), plus the additional \u201car\u00fa,\u201d I\u2019ll wrap up this series with just a few more examples.\u00a0 \u00a0A few are new to this series and some are representative expressions…<\/p>\n

Continue Reading<\/a><\/p>","protected":false},"author":36,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"content-type":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[11948,10663,11949,11955,11653,11952,11953,11950,11954,11951,11654,11947],"class_list":["post-460","post","type-post","status-publish","hentry","category-uncategorized","tag-ar-aghaidh","tag-before","tag-faoi-bhraid","tag-gan-mhoill","tag-roimh","tag-roimh-i-bhfad","tag-sar-i-bhfad","tag-sara","tag-sara-fada","tag-sarar","tag-sula","tag-sular"],"aioseo_notices":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/460","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/36"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=460"}],"version-history":[{"count":3,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/460\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":463,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/460\/revisions\/463"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=460"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=460"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=460"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}