{"id":9572,"date":"2017-08-23T01:57:07","date_gmt":"2017-08-23T01:57:07","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/?p=9572"},"modified":"2017-09-06T10:49:10","modified_gmt":"2017-09-06T10:49:10","slug":"orduimhreacha-agus-na-hurlair-i-bhfoirgnimh-ordinal-numbers-and-the-floors-in-buildings","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/orduimhreacha-agus-na-hurlair-i-bhfoirgnimh-ordinal-numbers-and-the-floors-in-buildings\/","title":{"rendered":"Orduimhreacha agus na hUrl\u00e1ir i bhFoirgnimh (Ordinal Numbers and the Floors in Buildings)"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

(le R\u00f3isl\u00edn; d.a.s. tiocfaidh cuid 2 de “Vocabulary Round-up from ‘More Irish Numbers Practice: Orduimhreacha i dTeidil Scann\u00e1n'” roimh i bhfad )<\/strong><\/p>\n

Cuir i gc\u00e1s gur turas\u00f3ir Meirice\u00e1nach in \u00c9irinn th\u00fa.\u00a0 T\u00e1 t\u00fa i dteach l\u00f3ist\u00edn, ag cl\u00e1r\u00fa agus ag f\u00e1il eochair do sheomra.\u00a0 Deir bean an t\u00ed go bhfuil do sheomra ar an gc\u00e9ad url\u00e1r agus go bhfuil an staighre thall ansin.\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

“Staighre?” a deir t\u00fa leat f\u00e9in.\u00a0 “C\u00e9n f\u00e1th staighre m\u00e1 t\u00e1 mo sheomra ar an gc\u00e9ad url\u00e1r?”\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

T\u00e1 an chuma ort go bhfuil mearbhall ort.\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

Deir bean an t\u00ed ar\u00eds. “T\u00e1 an staighre thall ansin.\u00a0 T\u00e1 do sheomra ar an gc\u00e9ad url\u00e1r.\u00a0 \u00d3, sea, rinne m\u00e9 dearmad.\u00a0 T\u00e1 c\u00f3ras eile i Meirice\u00e1.\u00a0 Anseo in \u00c9irinn, deir muid “bunurl\u00e1r” (n\u00f3 “url\u00e1r na tal\u00fan”) don url\u00e1r at\u00e1 ar leibh\u00e9al na sr\u00e1ide.\u00a0 T\u00e1 an “ch\u00e9ad url\u00e1r” os \u00e1r gcionn.\u00a0 Agus an dara hurl\u00e1r os a chionn sin.”<\/strong><\/p>\n

“\u00d3, sea, tuigim anois,” a deir t\u00fa.\u00a0 “C\u00f3ras difri\u00fail eile.\u00a0 An oiread sin de dhifr\u00edochta\u00ed agus t\u00fa ag taisteal.\u00a0 Celsius agus Fahrenheit.\u00a0 Cilim\u00e9adair agus m\u00edlte. Ceintim\u00e9adair agus orla\u00ed. \u00a0Agus fi\u00fa difr\u00edochta\u00ed sa Bh\u00e9arla, mar shampla, <\/strong>“check” vs. <\/strong>“bill” i mbialann.\u00a0 Agus <\/strong>“jumper” mar chine\u00e1l g\u00fana i Meirice\u00e1 agus <\/strong>“jumper” mar chine\u00e1l geansa\u00ed in \u00c9irinn agus sa Bhreatain.\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

“Bhuel,” a deir bean an t\u00ed, “mar a deir an seanfhocal, ‘Beag\u00e1n de mh\u00f3r\u00e1n a mh\u00e9ada\u00edonn do dh\u00fail.'”<\/strong><\/p>\n

“Is f\u00edor sin,” a deir t\u00fa, “agus b\u00edonn ciall i seanfhocail.\u00a0 Mar a deir seanfhocal eile, “N\u00ed f\u00e9idir an seanfhocal a sh\u00e1r\u00fa.”<\/strong><\/p>\n

“N\u00ed f\u00e9idir,” a deir bean an t\u00ed.\u00a0 “Anois, m\u00e1 t\u00e1 rud ar bith de dh\u00edth ort … pili\u00far eile … tu\u00e1ille eile… blainc\u00e9ad eile \u00a0… blainc\u00e9ad leictreach … ”\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

Got it?<\/p>\n

Here’s a gluais<\/strong> bheag<\/strong> for readers at a sort of intermediate level.\u00a0 A full translation is given further down.<\/p>\n

cuir i gc\u00e1s<\/strong>, imagine (lit. put in a case or situation)<\/p>\n

mearbhall<\/strong>, confusion<\/p>\n

bunurl\u00e1r (n\u00f3 “url\u00e1r na tal\u00fan)<\/strong>, ground floor<\/p>\n

os \u00e1r gcionn<\/strong>, above us; os a chionn sin<\/strong>, above that<\/p>\n

m\u00e9ada\u00edonn<\/strong>, increase(s) (briathar<\/strong>)<\/p>\n

d\u00fail<\/strong>, expectation, desire<\/p>\n

s\u00e1r\u00fa<\/strong>, to surpass<\/p>\n

Since the topic of “url\u00e1ir i bhfoirgnimh<\/strong>” came up in the most recent blogpost (nasc th\u00edos<\/strong>), I thought a little further explanation might help. \u00a0The basic idea is that there are two different systems for counting the floors of a building using ordinal numbers (orduimhreacha<\/strong>).\u00a0 In the American system (and perhaps Canadian — n\u00edl m\u00e9 cinnte … a Cheanadacha?<\/strong>), the ground floor (street level) is also the first floor.\u00a0 In Ireland and Britain, and as far as I know, in Europe in general, perhaps the world at large, the street level is just called the ground floor and may be marked “0” on an “ardaitheoir<\/strong>” (lift, elevator).\u00a0 In Irish, then, the “bunurl\u00e1r<\/strong>” isn’t normally “an ch\u00e9ad url\u00e1r<\/strong>.”<\/p>\n

It does bring up an interesting question.\u00a0 What should American learners of Irish do?\u00a0 Learn the European system for use in Ireland?\u00a0\u00a0 Stick to the American system but with Irish words for situations when one is talking in Irish in America?\u00a0 M\u00e1s cainteoir Gaeilge i Meirice\u00e1 th\u00fa, cad a deir tusa maidir le hurl\u00e1ir?\u00a0 Mar shampla, in \u00f3st\u00e1n:<\/strong><\/p>\n

T\u00e1 an Starbucks ar an gc\u00e9ad url\u00e1r, go d\u00edreach ar aghaidh, in aice leis an bpr\u00edomhshl\u00ed isteach.<\/strong><\/p>\n

OR: T\u00e1 an Starbucks ar an gc\u00e9ad url\u00e1r.\u00a0 T\u00e9igh suas an staighre agus ….<\/strong><\/p>\n

Bhur mbar\u00falacha, a l\u00e9itheoir\u00ed?\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

The graphic above, which I’ve adapted from the graphic I did for the “Muisc\u00edt ar an Deichi\u00fa hUrl\u00e1r<\/strong>” blogpost (an<\/strong>\u00a0nasc c\u00e9anna, th\u00edos<\/strong>), shows this in a (hopefully) clear manner.\u00a0 I will probably always get a kick out of a movie being called “Mosquito on the Tenth Floor,” but really, I did just pick it to translate here to practice ordinal numbers.<\/p>\n

Have any of you had any strange experiences traveling, wondering why you were told to go upstairs for the first floor when you thought you were already on the first floor, or conversely, why you went upstairs to what you thought was the first floor (mar shampla, Seomra 101) and couldn’t find what you were looking for?\u00a0 Which turned out to be on the floor below after all.<\/p>\n

And that raises an interesting question for thinking about the future.\u00a0 When we finally get a hotel on the moon (\u00f3st\u00e1n ar an ngealach<\/strong>), it will no doubt be the result of international scientific and commercial cooperation (which we’re soooo good at, as a species).\u00a0 So we’ll have to decide how to number the floors, regardless of whether it’s a Lunar Hilton or the infamous “Moonhattan Tilton” (from The Jetsons<\/em>) or let’s see, how about a Motel 933.66 (C\u00e9n f\u00e1th 933.66? Freagra th\u00edos<\/strong>). \u00a0C\u00f3ras Meirice\u00e1nach (m\u00e1 chuireann Meirice\u00e1 cuid mh\u00f3r den airgead sa tionscadal)? \u00a0C\u00f3ras Eorpach (mar t\u00e1 a l\u00e1n t\u00edortha i gceist)? \u00a0\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

Somehow I don’t recall the orbiting Hilton space station hotel in the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey<\/em> as having floors, so the numbering of floors is a moot point there (as far as I remember).\u00a0 I do remember the flight attendant walking “bunoscionn<\/strong>” to reach the passenger to serve the food, in what was it, some sort of shuttle?\u00a0 Ach url\u00e1ir dhifri\u00fala — n\u00ed cuimhin liom<\/strong>.\u00a0 Of course they might be called “decks (“deiceanna<\/strong>“) at that point, anyway.\u00a0 Bhuel<\/strong>, if anyone remembers better than me, about floors in that space-station Hilton, please do let me know.\u00a0 Meanwhile, rewatching 2001<\/em> for the umpeenth time goes back onto my to-do list.\u00a0 Last time was after having the privilege of meeting the two lead actors, Gary Lockwood and Keir Dullea in person at a convention.\u00a0 Now it’s to look at space-station architecture, if only to satisfy my own curiosity and to figure out how to describe the structure in Irish.<\/p>\n

Anyway, here’s the full translation of the convo above and below that the answer to why $933.66.\u00a0 And now there’s one more detail to watch for as you discuss foirgnimh, l\u00f3ist\u00edn\u00ed<\/strong>, and gormchl\u00f3nna — uimhri\u00fa na n-url\u00e1r. \u00a0<\/strong>\u00a0Sometime in the future we’ll also discuss whether triskaidekaphobia (f\u00f3ibe roimh an uimhir tr\u00ed d\u00e9ag<\/strong>) is also an issue for buildings in the Gaeltacht<\/strong>, but how many are there there that actually have thirteen floors?\u00a0 Or fourteen floors minus the unlucky 13th one? \u00a0Which would also be an interesting topic for the future. \u00a0Meanwhile, the next blogpost will be the continuation of “Vocabulary Round-up from ‘More Irish Numbers Practice: Orduimhreacha i dTeidil Scann\u00e1n.'”\u00a0SGF — R\u00f3isl\u00edn<\/strong><\/p>\n

Aistri\u00fach\u00e1n<\/strong><\/p>\n

Imagine you are an American tourist in Ireland.\u00a0 You are in a lodging house, registering\u00a0 and getting your room key.\u00a0 The bean an t\u00ed (proprietress\/landlady\/housewife) says your room is on the first floor and that the stairs are over there.<\/p>\n

“Stairs?” you say to yourself.\u00a0 “Why stairs if my room is on the first floor?”<\/p>\n

You look confused.<\/p>\n

The bean an t\u00ed says again, “The stairs are over there.\u00a0 Your room is on the first floor.\u00a0 Oh, yes, I forgot.\u00a0 There is another system in America.\u00a0 Here in Ireland, we say “ground floor” [url\u00e1r na tal\u00fan<\/strong> also means ground floor”] for the floor at street level.\u00a0 The “first floor” is above us.\u00a0 And the second floor is above that.”<\/p>\n

“Oh, yes, I understand now,” you say.\u00a0 “A different system.\u00a0 So many differences while you are traveling. Celsius and Fahrenheit.\u00a0 Kilometers and miles.\u00a0 Centimeters and inches.\u00a0 And even differences in the English, for example, “check” vs. “bill” in a restaurant.\u00a0 And “jumper” as a kind of dress in America and “jumper” as a kind of sweater in Ireland and Britain.”<\/p>\n

“Well,” says the bean an t\u00ed, “as the proverb says, “Variety is the spice of life.”<\/p>\n

“That’s true,” you say, “and proverbs contain wisdom.\u00a0 As another proverb says, ‘It’s not possible to surpass the proverb.'”\u00a0 [NB: English would probably just say “a proverb” here]<\/p>\n

“Yes [lit. “it isn’t possible,” agreeing with the previous statement], says the bean an t\u00ed.\u00a0 “Now, if you need anything else … another pillow … another towel … another blanket … an electric blanket … ”<\/p>\n

D\u00e1la an sc\u00e9il, is duitse an abairt dheireanach seo, a Vic\u00ed.C., m\u00e1 t\u00e1 t\u00fa ag l\u00e9amh an chomhr\u00e1 seo!\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n

BTW, the word “bean an t\u00ed” is so well known in Irish English today that I’m not putting it in bold here in this translation. \u00a0I do use the bold font sometimes to draw attention to Irish words that aren’t typically part of Irish English.<\/p>\n

N\u00f3ta<\/strong>: normally in Irish we wouldn’t say “the bean an t\u00ed,” using “an<\/strong>” (the) first and then the set phrase “bean an t\u00ed<\/strong>”\u00a0 because it would mean having two definite articles in one possessive noun phrase, which doesn’t happen in Irish.\u00a0 Remember, in Irish, “c\u00f3ta an chail\u00edn<\/strong>” means “the<\/em> coat of the girl,” with no “an<\/strong>” in front of “c\u00f3ta<\/strong>.”\u00a0 Similarly “cota Ch\u00e1it<\/strong>” means “the<\/em> coat of Kate” although the word “an<\/strong>” (the) doesn’t show up at all.\u00a0 Of course, we can also translate it as “Kate’s coat,” which doesn’t have “the” in English either.\u00a0 English can use either style (Kate’s coat OR the coat of Kate).<\/p>\n

Freagra<\/strong>: Why 933.66? To arrive at the figure 933.66, I used this site (http:\/\/www.in2013dollars.com\/1962-dollars-in-2117?amount=6&future_pct=0.03).\u00a0 Of course, I have no idea what the dollar amount will actually be, or if we’ll even still be using physical money by 2117. \u00a0I couldn’t find a similar predictive site for the euro. Nor do I have any idea how many years it will be until we have a hotel on the moon (\u00f3st\u00e1n ar an<\/strong> __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __, remember?).\u00a0 But it seemed like a fun thing to try.\u00a0 And since Motel 6 got its name from its original $6.00 a night price tag (in 1962), I figured checking the inflation value predicted for 2117 would be fun.\u00a0 And 933.66 sounds futuristic enough to be mildly convincing.\u00a0 Or at least attention-getting!<\/p>\n

Nasc don iarbhlagmh\u00edr:\u00a0<\/strong>Vocabulary Round-up from \u2018More Irish Numbers Practice: Orduimhreacha i dTeidil Scann\u00e1n\u2019 (Cuid\/Part 1)\u00a0<\/a>Posted by\u00a0r\u00f3isl\u00edn<\/a>\u00a0on Aug 20, 2017 in\u00a0Irish Language<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"\"\"

(le R\u00f3isl\u00edn; d.a.s. tiocfaidh cuid 2 de “Vocabulary Round-up from ‘More Irish Numbers Practice: Orduimhreacha i dTeidil Scann\u00e1n’” roimh i bhfad ) Cuir i gc\u00e1s gur turas\u00f3ir Meirice\u00e1nach in \u00c9irinn th\u00fa.\u00a0 T\u00e1 t\u00fa i dteach l\u00f3ist\u00edn, ag cl\u00e1r\u00fa agus ag f\u00e1il eochair do sheomra.\u00a0 Deir bean an t\u00ed go bhfuil do sheomra ar an gc\u00e9ad…<\/p>\n

Continue Reading<\/a><\/p>","protected":false},"author":36,"featured_media":9576,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"content-type":""},"categories":[3898],"tags":[489737,489735,489736,96696,489734],"class_list":["post-9572","post","type-post","status-publish","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-irish-language","tag-hurlair","tag-hurlar","tag-n-urlar","tag-orduimhreacha","tag-urlar"],"aioseo_notices":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/9572","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/36"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=9572"}],"version-history":[{"count":7,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/9572\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":9580,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/9572\/revisions\/9580"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/9576"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=9572"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=9572"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blogs.transparent.com\/irish\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=9572"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}